Believe Big Podcast

94-Chris Joseph - Stage 3 Pancreatic Cancer, Defying the Odds

• Ivelisse Page & Chris Joseph • Season 3 • Episode 94

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This week on the Believe Big Podcast, we welcome Chris Joseph, an eight-and-a-half-year survivor of stage 3 pancreatic cancer who defied the odds—and the statistics—by completely transforming his approach to healing.

At one point, Chris was told that chemotherapy was his only real option. But when the treatment left him even sicker and failed to stop the cancer, he made a courageous decision: to take control of his health and walk a different path—one guided by faith, intentional living, and a commitment to his own well-being.

In this inspiring episode, Chris shares:

  • The pivotal moment he knew he had to walk away from conventional treatment
  • Why stepping into the role of CEO of your own health is essential
  • The lifestyle and emotional changes that played a key role in his recovery
  • A revealing look at cancer statistics—and why you shouldn't let them define your outcome
  • How he's now guiding others as a coach and advocate to reclaim their power and pursue healing

Chris’s story is a testament to what can happen when you combine faith, courage, and a willingness to explore every avenue toward healing. You don’t want to miss this one.

Learn more about Chris here:  Terrain Navigators

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Ivelisse Page:

Hi, I'm Ivelisse Page and thanks for listening to the Believe Big podcast, the show where we take deep dive into your healing with health experts, integrative practitioners, biblical faith leaders, and cancer thrivers from around the globe. Welcome to today's episode on the Believe Big podcast. My name is Ivelisse Page and it's an honor to spend this time with you. Today, we welcome to the podcast my new friend Chris Joseph, diagnosed in 2016. Chris is an eight and a half year overcomer of stage three pancreatic cancer. With a village of support, Chris healed himself using the principles of the metabolic approach to cancer and also the 10 factors of radical remission. Now as a certified metabolic terrain advocate and a radical remission certified health coach, I. Chris utilizes these same concepts and teaching and coaching cancer patients how to take charge of their health and to find their pathway to healing. Chris is also a dad, environmental consultant, thought-leader, public speaker, a founder of two music record companies, and a nonprofit helping New Orleans artists and musicians. He is also the author of the bestselling memoir, Life Is A Ride: My Unconventional Journey of Cancer Recovery and is now writing his next book, the Kitchen Sink Approach to Cancer, and Why You Shouldn't. Always Listen To Your Doctor. He can be reached at terrainnavigators.com. Welcome to the show.

Chris Joseph:

Thank you so much for having me.

Ivelisse Page:

Yeah. Well, we're so excited to speak with you today. It was so nice to meet you at that conference and to hear your story in person. So thank you for coming on to the podcast and sharing you know, what you went through. I know that our listeners will be really excited to hear what you have to say. And so we always like to start with our favorite health tip. So I know you probably have many, but what would you say is your favorite?

Chris Joseph:

Um, before I answer, I will tell you that I get asked that question all the time. Tell me what you did. Tell me the number one thing you did. So, um, the number one thing is I, it, when you read my intro, it was actually in the intro, and that is taking charge of your health, being the CEO of your journey. The day I quit chemo in early 2017 after chemo wasn't working. Day that changed my trajectory and by the way, I want to be clear, I'm not recommending anyone quit chemo or anything like that. My journey is my journey When I took charge of my health, that was the game changer, and it's the number one thing I tell people.

Ivelisse Page:

I completely agree. Be your own advocate. You know your body best and, you know, follow your instincts and make sure that you do what's best for you, no matter.

Chris Joseph:

Yeah.

Ivelisse Page:

You know, no matter who's saying what to you, you know, what's best. Um, yeah. Intrinsic intrinsically, um, for me, I, I also sought guidance from the Holy Spirit, and I felt like prayer really helped me to make those decisions as well. Um, so I love that health tip so much. And so can you take us back to your initial diagnosis in 2016? Like what symptoms led you to even seek medical attention?

Chris Joseph:

So in the summer of 2016, I was experiencing some depression, pretty serious depression, which was unusual'cause my life was going really well. Um, I, I was in a good relationship. My kids were doing well, I was doing well in the job. Nothing abnormal, nothing to make me sad, but I was profoundly depressed and it was unusual and I was worried about it. Concurrently I started losing weight. And the third thing was I was having lingering stomach issues. It was never pain, but it would keep me up at night. I would actually go from like the bed to the couch'cause I couldn't sleep. And so finally, after about a month or so of all this, maybe a couple months actually, I went to my regular doctor. He felt around, he said, oh, you should go get a scan. And so I went to get a scan on October 31st, Halloween day of 2016. And that was when they told me I had stage three pancreatic cancer.

Ivelisse Page:

Wow. And so what were your first thoughts? What were your emotions?

Chris Joseph:

Well, I'm not allowed to cuss on this podcast, but, but that, that's, that's what crossed my mind like, holy crap. Um, at fear. I mean, it was profound fear. Um, I was by myself. Um, my ex-wife was actually in Australia. My girlfriend was at home, so I went to the appointment by myself and, and so I had no one with me. The radiologist, usually they take a week or two to give you the results. They told me like within an hour, and he didn't say much about it. He said, you have a, a big mass in your pancreas, and that was all he told me. And so it, I mean, it was fear. It was fear, and instantly I went into oh my God, I'm gonna die. Pancreatic cancer has such lousy outcomes. I didn't know the numbers, but I knew they were bad. And the hardest part, other than hearing that news, the hardest part that day was driving home. I was supposed to take my kids to their Halloween parties. There were 14 and 12 at the time, and I was driving home and I was crying in the car. And I, and I, I knew it was gonna be the tough, toughest conversation I'd ever had'cause I, I still get overwhelmed even telling the story now. And, and it turned out to be one of the toughest conversations that I ever had. I, I told them what I knew, which wasn't much, but they could see I was upset. I was crying. They held my hand, I held their hand. Sorry. Um,

Ivelisse Page:

no, it's okay.

Chris Joseph:

And yeah, so the first day, I mean, the first day, that part of it, even though it was a tough conversation just to share that love with them, that was amazing. That was amazing and to see how much they cared. And I didn't wanna scare them and I don't know that I did. Uh, I'm sure they were worried, but, um, it was a good reminder right away that this was gonna take a village, which is another tip. It really does take a village to go through something like this.

Ivelisse Page:

Yeah. You know, that's a question that I get asked a lot is how did you share that with your kids? Like some people feel like they need to hide things until they know more. And that was my story where I just felt like it was important to be upfront and honest with what was happening. So how did you present that in a way that didn't scare them, but also let them know that it was serious?

Chris Joseph:

I, I told them what the radiologist told me, but they could see how I was upset'cause I was crying when I told them. So they knew I was scared. I told'em, I didn't really know what it meant and I didn't, I mean, they actually didn't say cancer to me at that moment at the clinic. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I just told them the truth. I told'em what I knew and I didn't want to keep it a secret from them. I didn't want to keep it a secret from anyone. I mean, once I knew it was cancer, once I knew what stage it was, I, I started writing blogs. I. Within a week or two, um, I was doing, and that's right when Facebook Live started. So I was doing Facebook Lives, which were, you know, some people didn't like watching, you know, they, it made them uncomfortable. Some people thought it was very brave. I just knew I couldn't keep it a secret. I was like, you, I couldn't do it.

Ivelisse Page:

Yeah. And I think that in some ways you help to encourage and educate other people through that process, and everyone has a different thought and that's okay. You know, some people are more private and that's okay, and others are more public like us, and that's okay too. There's no right way to go about it. It's what's best for you and your situation. And so knowing this, what treatment options were you initially presented with and how did you decide on your approach?

Chris Joseph:

The only option they gave me upfront was chemotherapy. They said surgery wasn't possible because the tumor was wrapped around an artery or a vein. I forget. Um, they said radiation wasn't possible because of the same location of that tumor. So I did what most people do. I listened to my doctor, um, sort of what we're trained to do from birth, right? The doctor knows best. Sometimes they do. Uh, I'm not here to criticize doctors or western medicine, but doctors don't know how I'm feeling. Doctors don't know my body. Doctors don't know. Sometimes they don't know a lot about health. Um, but I did. I, you know, starting out, I did exactly what they told me to do, which was chemo, and that I did it for about three or four months. Actually, I did it for two months. It wasn't working. I got a, a scan and the scan showed the tumor was growing, so I, they upped the chemo and then I was just miserable and it still wasn't working. So, in March of 2017, that's when I took charge of my health and quit, um, quit chemo. Don't try this at home. Listeners. I quit chemo, fired my oncologist. I have not talked to him since, and, um, didn't have a plan B. At that time, I just thought, there's gotta be a plan B. There has to be, but I didn't know it.

Ivelisse Page:

Yeah, and I think what a lot of people don't realize is that conventional oncologists can only offer three things. Surgery, chemo, and radiation. Unless it's standard of care here in the United States, they can actually be sued if they offer anything outside of those three things. And so that's why it's so limited, and that's why at Believe Big we're always sharing, you need a team, you need a people that are specialized in integrative medicine, that specialize in integrative oncology, and of course an oncologist too that can help to monitor you when it's important to do so. And so, I love your bravery and your courage. When you stopped doing the chemotherapy and what did your family say or how did, did you, how did you move to your next step?

Chris Joseph:

Well, well, like I said, I was posting about it. I was very public about everything and so I remember even posting that I'm gonna quit chemo. I don't know what I'm gonna do. And I didn't at the time, know what I was gonna do. My family, everyone to my face respected my decision, which was really great. It was really lovely. Um, what they were thinking, I don't know. I mean, you know, there was a part of me that thought I was crazy for doing it. And had the chemo been working, I might have actually continued with that, but I, I, I looked at the, at the numbers and 70% of pancreatic cancer patients are dead within a year. I was in like the fourth month and chemo wasn't working. They didn't offer surgery, they didn't offer radiation. This is not a good trajectory. So for me it wasn't really, wasn't that hard of a decision for me, and it could have been a disaster. I mean, there, as we know, there's nothing that's a hundred percent guaranteed. I could have quit and gone down some other path and maybe it wouldn't have worked.

Ivelisse Page:

Yeah, so I know everybody's situation is different and I'm myself, I'm very careful not to share exactly what I did,'cause I don't want people to feel like, well, if I do what Ivelisse did, or if I do what Chris did, then this is the result because everybody's situation is different. And that's why integrative medicine works best when it's individualized and not standardized. And so, but what would you say were the top three things that you did to support your body into healing?

Chris Joseph:

As I said, number one, taking charge of my health. Number two, realizing that I had to work my fanny off to get healthy. This is hard work and I'm a cancer coach now, and I tell people that right up front. This is not for the passive that the people who put in the effort, it's like when you were going to college, you get out of it what you put into it. And it's the same thing with your health. I think what I've learned, and I started learning it in 2017, is I had to get healthier and so I learned how to eat healthier. I was never a, a lousy eater. Sometimes I was, but I mean, overall I was probably a little better than average, but I really started paying attention to what I was putting in my body. I started moving my body more. I dealt with stress. I had come out of a bad marriage, difficult marriage. Uh, my company had fallen apart in 2010, which I'm sure contributed to the stress that led to, you know, one of the contributing factors to cancer. I just started paying attention to my health more and being much more mindful. To be honest, I probably became a little more selfish, because I had to do that to stay alive. But I figured in order to stay alive to, because I was the breadwinner. I need to do this. Mm-hmm. Otherwise I'm not gonna live. And there's no other breadwinner here. So it was a, it was sort of a combination of factors. Um, no one thing.

Ivelisse Page:

Yes. So physically you changed your diet. Mm-hmm. And, and then you did probably a lot of emotional work in order to get rid of all the stress and certain things that you had experienced that were physiologically causing cortisol and other things. Mm-hmm. And preventing your body from healing. And so, wow. That's just amazing to me that you also did not do surgery and that you didn't do radiation and that you are here doing these simple things that turned your life around. It's amazing.

Chris Joseph:

Yeah. I, I wanna be fair, I actually did do a little bit more western medicine. Um, but when I quit chemo, the first thing I did was I went to my integrative doctor, um, Melanie Giesler in Los Angeles, and I started getting IV therapies and learning more about health. Melanie wanted me to do keto. And, uh, I didn't know at the time she was actually consulting with Dr. Nasha Winters. Mm-hmm. That was before I knew, who knew who Nasha was. So Nasha actually consulted on my case, but they wanted me to do keto. And, I always get a little trouble for saying this, but I never did keto. and not, not because I don't believe in it, I actually do, strongly believe in it. I was a single dad. My kids were 14 and 12, and the big thing is I don't cook. And so it was just too challenging. Um, so when the suggestion was made to do keto, I said, ah, I don't think I can do that. But it didn't stop me from eating healthier and eating low carb and eating organic when I could, which was much of the time. And cutting out processed foods and really focusing on the low carb. I mean, I was probably in ketosis many times. I never tested myself back then, but I'm sure I was in ketosis sometimes.

Ivelisse Page:

Yeah. If someone is listening right now and is facing a pancreatic cancer diagnosis, what advice would you give them?

Chris Joseph:

What a great question. I mean, the first thing I tell them is that, ignore the numbers. Ignore the stats. Those are just stats. Um, I get so angry when doctors tell patients, oh, you have six months to live, or whatever it is. I mean, the, the honest thing that doctors could do would be to say, I don't know what else I can do for you, because that really would be honest. And what more do we want from our providers is just tell us the truth. Truth is they have hit their level, their limit of knowledge. And then what I think they should say is, but you might wanna try an alternative doctor or something like that. Um, now I forgot what your question was. I went off on the

Ivelisse Page:

No, what, you know, what would advice, would you give someone with a pancreatic cancer diagnose? Mm-hmm.

Chris Joseph:

Ignore the numbers, as I said. Start getting healthier. Start getting healthier. I mean, 90 some upwards of 90% of cancers are environmental and lifestyle cause not hereditary. And to me that's an opportunity. That's an opportunity. Like, oh, okay, if I was eating, you know, maybe part of this was I was eating louy. Okay, I'm gonna start eating healthier, I'm gonna move my body more. If it was hereditary, I don't know what else I could do. Right? I mean, I, maybe the same things, but I would feel more limited and more helpless. Environmental and lifestyle got me here. So environmental and lifestyle's gonna get me outta this too.

Ivelisse Page:

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Chris Joseph:

And it turned out to be true.

Ivelisse Page:

Yeah. And even for those that do have a genetic, you know, I fell into that 5%, uh, genetics. And you know, I believe you can switch on and off those genes depending on what you do as well. So the same things apply to both. Yeah. I believe whether it's genetic or not. And so, you know, what you do is so important and so, you now coach and teach others who are facing all types of cancers, correct? Not just pancreatic cancer. You help all cancers?

Chris Joseph:

I do. I mean, I, I've sort of become a go-to person on the pancreatic cancer side, um, because people have heard about my journey from me being so public about it or writing the book or doing podcasts. I work with people with all types of cancers. It almost, in some respects, doesn't matter what the cancer is'cause I'm, I'm not teaching the same things. Everyone, as you pointed out, everyone's journey is individual. I don't exactly know until I talk to someone what might be, what might be best for them.

Ivelisse Page:

What is one of the most rewarding aspect of this work?

Chris Joseph:

Um, when I see people willing to do the work, when I see people who are willing to question what they're doing, when I see people willing to question their doctors, their healthcare providers, I want them to question me. I don't want them to take what I say from face value. And so I can often tell the ones who are willing to do that. Obviously it's gratifying to see some, see some people do well, some people do not. I mean, that's just the reality. I've learned as a coach over the years now that, I It's their journey.

Ivelisse Page:

Yes. Yeah. It's their journey. I agree. And so now that you are a terrain advocate and also a radical remission coach, how are those similar? Or, or how are they different in what you teach people?

Chris Joseph:

The part that I work with, it's all lifestyle, it's all, you know, it's mental, emotional. Those buckets are the same, whether it's Radical Remission or, or Metabolic Terrain Institute of Health. Um, eating healthy is in both camps? Exercises In both camps. Yeah. There's lots of overlap. In fact I'm working with both groups to try and get them to work together even more than they already have. But yeah, there's, there's tons of overlap. Maybe how it's approach might be a little different, but yeah. There's a lot of overlap.

Ivelisse Page:

Yes. Yes. And you're writing a new book now, the Kitchen Sink Approach to Cancer. Tell us a little bit more about that.

Chris Joseph:

So the first book that I wrote in 2020, and the reason I wrote that book, the biggest reason was I wrote it for my kids. It turned out they haven't read it. Um, I'm sure they will at some point, but their response was they lived it so they don't have to read it, and they're not wrong about that. Um, but I, I knew I had a good story with pancreatic cancer, so that's why I wrote that book. And I, I wrote it. in memoir form. Because people can't really argue with memoir. Your story is your story. I mean, it's possible. I got a fact wrong here or there, and I'm sure I did, but no one could argue with my journey and I didn't really wanna argue with people. If I would've used it as a platform, people can argue with that. So that was 2020. 2025, I'm not nearly as shy about trying to advocate for better health and alternative cancer care, and just getting people healthy, healthier in general. Um, can I bring up something which might sound a little controversial? Sure. But it's not, I promise you. I, I, when I talk to people, I bring up covid and people get triggered by vaccines and masks and lockdowns. Even years later, they, it's still a triggering thing. I don't talk about any of those things. I have my opinions, but I don't talk about them. But I bring up Covid with people and now with you because Covid shined a light on how unhealthy this country is. And we really didn't do much about it. In fact, we were sort of told the opposite, you know, stay indoors and bake, and then it couldn't have been worse advice. And so part of my journey is to not only help cancer patients, but to just talk about health in general and to talk about the importance of getting healthier. I know you know this, doing what you do. I mean, this is a profoundly unhealthy country, and I don't say that with criticism. It's just the truth. And so why am I writing this other book? The new book will be more not just memoir, but opinions hopefully backed up as by as much science as I can. But I am now much more courageous about like, Hey, what we're doing over here it's not really working. Yeah, it's not really working.

Ivelisse Page:

Yeah. And I, I think it really did show how unhealthy our country is, and it made it unhealthier because like you said, people were inside, they weren't outside exercising and doing all the things that they, they did. But I think one of the positives that happened through COVID was that people are questioning and asking more questions now than they used to before blindly take things or, uh, you know, as far as their health, they're taking more control of their health and being more curious. And I think that is a positive thing for our country. And I do hope that it turns around because the obesity rates have skyrocketed and mm-hmm. And just even, the health overall in our country. So, so, yeah. I'm so glad that you will be addressing that in your, in your next book. So if you had to look back. Right now, what would be one thing you would've changed? If you back then, if you know what you knew now, what would you have changed starting out?

Chris Joseph:

I'm gonna give this, um, qualifier upfront. I do not advise other people to follow my journey. Um, but if I could go back and do one thing differently, I would not have done chemo. I were to started out right away doing alternative stuff. Yeah. And that's not to say that chemo can't help some people. I've actually seen it help some people, so that's why I wanna be fair about that. But for me, it was not helping, it was hurting. I was going, I was on a trajectory to die of chemo before I was gonna die of cancer. So, yeah, I, and, and go ahead.

Ivelisse Page:

Yeah, and I said that's why the, that it's really important to ask those right questions and like it was not effective or being effective for you. And so, you know, I always tell people before if I would've even considered that, I would've done a test to determine whether or not my tumor would've been receptive to that. And they do have sensitivity tests that can test different types of chemotherapy before your body undergoes that kind of, treatment and breaking it down to see if it would even be effective. So there are several of those tests that even conventional hospitals can do that can really help to determine and answer those questions for patients, which I find helpful now.

Chris Joseph:

Yeah, I think it's great. My, my first oncologist. I'm gonna guess he knew about those tests, but chose not to run them. It was Dr. Giesler, who my in integrative doctor, who did run those tests for me and found the, yes, my body does not do a good job of flushing out toxins and we know chemo is a toxin. So yeah, it was not right for me.

Ivelisse Page:

Yeah. So as we close, um, looking back on the last eight and a half years, what has this journey taught you about life, resilience and healing?

Chris Joseph:

If you would've told me, or if anyone would've told me eight and a half years ago that my life would be better after getting diagnosed with pancreatic cancer, I would've said crazy. That's not possible. My life is better. My life is richer. In some ways it's more fun. I mean, I wish I could have achieved all this and, and experienced all of this without having the cancer, but you know, that was what it was. That's what propelled me into this, this healing journey. So my life's better. It's better. I'm much more aware now. I'm much more awake. I'm much more mindful than I used to be. And I, and I wanna be clear also, I'm not, I'm not on a soapbox. I have much to learn, much to learn. Um, I'm on a journey just like everyone else is, but my life's better. I know that it's better.

Ivelisse Page:

That's great. Yeah, I completely agree. And would you want the diagnosis? Absolutely not. But on the other side of it, you see all of God's graces. I believe that he turns pain into purpose, and I see that in your life to now where you're using it to bless so many people and encourage and teach and help them to overcome their cancers. And so thank you, Chris, for what you do every day. For the patients that reach out to you, we will definitely put links to contact you and to your website so that people can easily get ahold of you if they have additional questions after listening to this podcast. But thank you for joining us today.

Chris Joseph:

Thank you.

Ivelisse Page:

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